New (to me) Model 12.

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Plain Old Dave
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Joined: Tue Sep 09, 2014 7:01 am

New (to me) Model 12.

Post by Plain Old Dave »

I say Model 12 as from what I can tell it PROBABLY predates suffixes. Overall Fair condition, and I am thinking there might just be some amount of rifling under a BUNCH of lead fouling. The bore reflects light, but appears smooth in some areas. Interestingly, the dirty patches have silvery metal flakes in them so my theory for now is that this rifle's bore is full of 100+ years of lead fouling. The non-plated bullet 22 shells were always cheaper at the feed store (or Co-Op later), so after a bit of neglect with Lesmok 22s or something similar, a corroded bore just kept building up fouling.Saw (and passed on) a Win-stretcher 1895 in .38-72 one time as I thought the bore was gone in it. Turned out the grooves were just full of 100+ years of fouling that only came out with electrolytic cleaning.

On to the gun. Serial number 61xxx and only has one patent date, but says "others pending." No Remington logo like my 14 and no model number. Am I right in thinking this is a first year of production gun? I'm only in for @$180 so if a relining is in order I'm not going to be upside down.
John Gyde
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Re: New (to me) Model 12.

Post by John Gyde »

1911 production was from #48,937 to #104,041 so it was made in the third year of production.
Plain Old Dave
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Re: New (to me) Model 12.

Post by Plain Old Dave »

Okay, thanks. Any lead/bullet wax removal suggestions?
John Gyde
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Re: New (to me) Model 12.

Post by John Gyde »

No, but I do have advise. Use only standard velocity ammo.
Plain Old Dave
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Re: New (to me) Model 12.

Post by Plain Old Dave »

Will take that under advisement. Haven't seen any other but high velocity anywhere local in a long time. Nobody around here has had any problems out of 12s related to ammo, though.
John Gyde
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Re: New (to me) Model 12.

Post by John Gyde »

The M/12 was made before hi vel ammo was introduced. It's fine to shoot Stingers or any hi-vel ammo. It will function just great. It's also OK to drink, then drive while blindfolded.

To be serious... If you shoot much hi vel ammo you will ruin the rifle. It's that simple. The M/121 had a "beefed" breechblock to hold up under the newer ammo. Your "nobody" friends will have problems if they continue to shoot hi-vel ammo...
Plain Old Dave
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Re: New (to me) Model 12.

Post by Plain Old Dave »

Found some Standard Velocity stuff, and oddly enough my 12 seems to feed Aguila well and not like CCI at all. Time to start experimenting and see if this sewer pipe of a bore will provide any sort of accuracy. Might even try single-feeding the subsonic CCIs I found.... Or maybe get the plated Armscor subsonic HPs I found. Patches are still coming out black and/or brown, so I am not yet prepared to say this is a "rurnt" barrel like they say out in the country.
John Gyde
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Re: New (to me) Model 12.

Post by John Gyde »

Thanks to Plain Old Dave for not beating me up for my caustic remarks. Good luck finding the perfect ammo for your rifle. A lot of folks use the hi-vel ammo in M/12s then learn that repeated use has damaged their rifles. Then it's too late.
Plain Old Dave
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Re: New (to me) Model 12.

Post by Plain Old Dave »

Modest update: I must not have had the mag tube seated when I was test-feeding the Aguilas, as the mag is completely inop. Drop even one round through the tube and latch the tube and it locks up. Release tension and it feeds like a champ. Disassembled the piece to inspect for worn/damaged/missing parts and found that the Cartridge Retainer (#57 at Wisner's ) is missing. Given that one of the screws that retains the pump handle is missing, it occurred that the retainer dropped out when a previous owner disassembled it and he/she never saw it was gone as the piece just lays in a keyway at 6:00 on the barrel. @$30 will get this squared away, but I probably will need to reline the barrel. Hopefully I will find a local that can handle this task.
Plain Old Dave
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Re: New (to me) Model 12.

Post by Plain Old Dave »

One dead end I have hit on is the buttplate. Every repro I see has the Remington-UMC logo (which not even my buttplate has) and is the best part of an inch longer from heel to toe than mine is. Mine says "Remington Arms Co." in a circle and is only about 4" from heel to toe. Looks like some I have seen advertised for early Model 8s. Help?
Plain Old Dave
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Re: New (to me) Model 12.

Post by Plain Old Dave »

Finally got the little flat metal piece (cartridge retainer?) in so my rifle will work as a repeater. Looks like all the pictures I have seen of early Model 12 Cartridge retainers, but the magazine won't go back in the reciever with the piece in the keyway on the bottom of the barrel. Seen youtube videos of people hammering them in the back, but the Remington pub says it should just slide back together. HELP!
The Gamemaster
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Re: New (to me) Model 12.

Post by The Gamemaster »

Just a thought, but if you can disassemble the rifle, why not take a propane torch and gently heat the barrel and see if the lead will come out on it's own.

Maybe you could push a brush up and down the bore a couple of times while you are heating it.

There is a lot of different foul remover compounds on the market that I would try before I relined the barrel.

Hoppe's Elite Bore Gel, Birchwood Casey Bore Scrubber Foaming Gel Bore Cleaner etc...
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DavidFagan
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Re: New (to me) Model 12.

Post by DavidFagan »

I'm not sure I'm following this exactly but there is the vinegar and peroxide trick, it does remove lead, it DOES REMOVE BLUE, so be very careful and we are talking a minute or two duration.
Google it I'm sure there's a youtube or something ;)
David J. Fagan
The Silicon Sorcerer
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